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31/08/2014 at 11:35 am in reply to: Balcony enclosures – who’s responsible for common property issues? #22210
Mucho thanks for your comments, kiwipaul. Although we didn’t ourselves do the installations we have documents to prove the installations were fully compliant with the relevant bylaw (including council permission and a structural engineer’s report), and had OC approval.
Which begs the question – how can subsequent owners be held solely responsible for possible consequences from approved works 20 years + later?
27/08/2014 at 1:38 pm in reply to: Balcony enclosures – who’s responsible for common property issues? #22204Sorry, flat chatters – my post may have been a little garbled.
To be surer of our ground, the basic queries are:
- Does Section 62 of the NSW SSMA take precedence over any special bylaws as regards the repair of common property?
- Is there a legal difference between structural repairs and maintenance (painting, cosmetic works etc.)?
- Can obligations be transferred automatically to successive owners without their agreement if they are not spelled out on individual title deeds?
Any advice or views would be really appreciated.
Thanks Whale for your comprehensive and insightful comments. Will be following up your suggestions in the coming week.
There is no record of any OC consent for any of the illegal works, but will try to obtain written confirmation of this.
Find it incongruous that individual owners cannot be held financially liable for ‘making good’ unapproved major alterations to / or removal of common property within their units but the OC can.
Ironically there is a suggestion that the sliding doors / windows may no longer be considered common property if the balcony is already fully enclosed. Isn’t strata confusing?
Thanks again for your helpful advice.
@Whale said:
Clause 76(4) of the NSW Strata Schemes Management Act (1996) is the relevant reference, where it states:“(4) If the owners corporation is subsequently faced with other expenses it cannot at once meet from either fund, it must levy on each owner a contribution to the administrative fund, determined at a general meeting of the owners corporation, in order to meet the expenses.”
Thanks Whale & kiwipaul for your replies. The difficulty here is the EC control over 50% of the building through either passive or non resident owners. So, although our sinking fund is currently quite healthy, the EC don’t want to use it for low status building work preferring to keep it for as yet unauthorised pet projects (extending the lobby, chintzy artworks, etc).
That’s the situation we are in –
@Whale said:
Tracer – as others have said, a Special Resolution is not be required in order for the Owners Corporation (O/C) to vote on painting of the Common Property, but if your Executive Committee (E/C) is as you advised proposing “silver metal sculptures, signage, tiling” and those items are not there now, then they’re considered additions and /or alterations and/or new structures on the Common Property, and the O/C does need to vote on those by way of the Special Resolution as proposed [NSW Strata Schemes Management Act (SCMA); Cl.65A].So you have a few options:
- Obviously the paint’s existing, and if everything else now proposed to be updated (i.e. sculptures et al) is just replacing something existing at the same locations, then a vote by a simple majority can decide whether the Motion is passed or defeated.
- If the sculptures etc are additions to what’s there now, or in different locations, then a vote by >25% of those in attendance at the Meeting, both personally and by proxy, can defeat the Special Resolution Motion or amend it to any extent that does not alter the intent of what’s proposed – and as that’s for the O/C to comply with its obligation to “properly maintain its Common Property” (SCMA; Cl.62), the intent’s pretty broad and there’s therefore ample scope for complying amendments!
- If like-minded Owners want to take a more moderate approach than to defeat the Motion (as you suggest), then consider it as put (i.e. as a Special Resolution) and >25% of those could then vote to defer any decision at all until such time as the E/C comes back with more details, obtains additional quotations, or as you suggest simply gives Owners some time to receive and contemplate the detail of the information that’s intended to be provided at the Meeting. Bear in mind of course that another General Meeting will need to convened to make a decision once everyone’s contemplated and had their input.
Lastly, if your Plan has >100 Lots and the expenditure proposed under the Motion exceeds $30,000 then a minimum two (2) quotations is mandatory under the Regulation (2010) to the SCMA, and, if you want to achieve your desired outcome then you’ll need to do some lobbying between now and the Meeting to get ≥25% on-side; that’s calculated by unit entitlement by the way, not by Lot ownership.
Thanks for your advice Whale etall – very frustrating when an EC behaves more like a secret society or tribal elite than an aware and reasonable group of owners. If you are fortunate enough to have a sensible and responsible EC, they are gold!
@kiwipaul said:
In QLD changing the exterior color of a building has been considered an alteration to common property and so requires a SR (an interpretation I think is crazy).Agreeing to a motion without any quotes whatsoever is giving the people who proposed this motion (EC?) virtually a blank cheque to do whatever they like and all owners will have to foot the bill.
At the very least at the AGM a max spending limit should be added to the motion to limit your expenditure. If cost (or quote or estimate) goes beyond this limit EC have to come back to owners for further approval.
Ideally you should have at least 2 detailed quotes showing what is going to be done and the cost before you vote on the item and you should advise everybody before the AGM to vote AGAINST the motion unless quotes are supplied.
Yes, these special resolutions are submitted by the EC. We know painting is involved as it was mentioned in a brief report by a colour consultant annexed to the agenda. Silver metal sculptures, signage, tiling were also mentioned however there is no coherent plan or proposal in evidence. Peasant owners are being told that “all will be revealed at the AGM; and voted on”.
I agree that it is asking for a blank cheque unless a reasonably firm proposal with indicative pricing / quotes is provided.
As the EC resolutions are at the very least premature and ill considered, would it be reasonable to move to attempt to defer these special motions and give time for owners to have a look and input views before ‘purchasing’. Otherwise, we are being steamrolled!
@JimmyT said:
OK, that settles it. I am forming a Strata Swat Team. We will descend upon dysfunctional ECs, crashing through the windows on abseiling ropes, if need be ready to dispense instant strata karma to the backsliders, nest-featherers, prevaricators, procrastinators and preposterous, posturing petty potentates that blight the bottom tier of democracy in this country.We’ll issue sheaves of Notices to Comply, arrange EGMs at which all the baddies will be de-elected, clamp a few cars (just for fun) and then roar away on our StratMobile, leaving only a massive special levy which will be required to pay our extortionate fees.
Any takers?
This is a profoundly excellent idea! Our very own StratSwat team!! Let’s gather our mallets and get to it!!
@scotlandx said:
Conflict of interest is a universal governance issue, it doesn’t just apply to strata, it is up to individual schemes to determine how they deal with it. If you are concerned about how these matters are handled, one approach is to have the EC adopt a conflict of interest policy that sets out how it deals with it. There are plenty of examples on the internet on which you can base a policy.Personally, I do have an issue with an EC member having a direct interest in the provision of services to the scheme. While it can work, and may in some instances cost less, it can create problems. For example, if a lot owner provides building services and there are defects that may lead to litigation. I agree with Whale and PeterC that in many instances an EC member may be doing the right thing, as it benefits them as an owner, but it can be tricky.
Two of us on the EC are in professions that could be used by the OC, but we would never offer to supply any services, because we would be worried about liability.
Certainly an EC member who is quoting should not have access to other quotes, because they are may use that confidential information for their own personal benefit. Similarly they should not vote and should absent themselves when the vote is taken.
Thanks for this, scotlandx – have placed a resolution on agenda for our upcoming agm. Although having an EC member undertake paid work can be beneficial, it is a quagmire unless sufficient controls are in place – this is not the case in our building (36 units) and the EC is unresponsive. Many owners are not even aware that the relevant parties are benefiting financially and have won 100% of the work in this field over the past 2 years. Time for an airing!
@kiwipaul said:
@tracer said:
I intend placing a motion on our AGM agenda to deal with conflict of interest issues but not sure how to phrase it.I regret to say the NSW Strata act dosn’t address the confilict of interest issue and so you have to rely on the honesty of the individuals concerned as you cannot legally stop them voting for their own motions concerning anything.
You might be able to introduce a bylaw that addresses this issue but to get it approved you would need a 75% vote in favour of the new bylaw passed at the AGM and then registered with NSW gov.
Thanks for this, kiwipaul. Realise the NSW Strata Act is mute on this issue however intend to submit a motion on the AGM agenda so owners may have the opportunity to air their views. Probably won’t get up however may prompt the EC to put some controls in place (wishful thinking). Our EC pretty well does what it likes (strata laws or not).
@JimmyT said:
@considerate band fair said:
How silly to get into spurious debate over what and if… put your money where your mouth is and say what you need to at the next AGM or AND put your hand up to be on the EC and be productive.What we’re talking about here is where the EC isn’t open and fair and you can stand for office as much as you like but you know the EC and their loyal supporters, plus those that they have convinced the sky will fall down if they aren’t elected, are going to vote themselves in every time. Then you get all the nastiness of the filthy looks and muttered imprecations as you walk around you own homes.
Friends of mine were bailed up in a cafe nearby by a friend of one of our EC’s ruling group when they said they wouldn’t be giving their proxy to the chair – and this woman doesn’t even own or live in the building!
Nothing spurious about this discussion at all. It can get very nasty and this is your home, after all. People feel isolated and frustrated and wonder if making their point is worth all the abuse they will inevitably receive. Roll on the end of proxy harvesting.
Hooray to this comment! Under current legislation it is just too easy for unscrupulous rent seekers to gain control of ECs and go about their wicked ways….
Whale – this is fine if you have the processes in place to keep things above board.
The trouble with our place is there are no processes (other than the parties not voting); remaining EC members vote as one on these contracts; some owners feel they are being taken for a ride; and the work undertaken is not done in a timely or professional manner.
I intend placing a motion on our AGM agenda to deal with conflict of interest issues but not sure how to phrase it.
Peter C – you are on a constructive and positive EC. Unfortunately our EC is very arrogant and sees any questioner as a “troublemaker and person of doubtful character”.
Utilising the expertise and skills of EC members effectively is very positive for all owners – however whether this should extend to payments for services (other than reimbursements) is another matter.
As the philosophers say: ‘power corrupts; especially when monetized” – or something like that
Peter C – Thanks for your views, which I shared until recently. Their quotes for specific contracts are regularly 10% cheaper than others obtained – however the rate charged for ongoing maintenance work and small jobs is significantly higher than previously.
I was interested to see that the Owners Corporation Network’s position on financial conflicts of interest is definite – people should neither nominate nor sit on a committee if they have a direct financial interest in any decisions. Abstaining from voting is immaterial as they would be privy to other quotes etc. The particular people involved have always had the last crack at quotations.
How do other Owners Corporations handle conflicts of interest issues?
Fair Trading advises that the 'appropriate' way to raise funding is by way of contributions and adjustments to the sinking fund (our current sinking fund has a number of unapproved discretionary items in it). Our concern is the EC is hopeful a large special levy faces likely rejection, whereas contributions to the sinking fund may be accepted out of habit. Sounds paranoid, but this EC has a 7 year history of neglect when it comes to structural works, preferring to spend money on cosmetic things.
We live in a block of 36 units built in the 1970s. There are 7 people on the EC and they have 8 firm proxies (including one who owns 3 units). Therefore they can easily stack the EC (which they do) and control the votes on most issues.
In hindsight, we should have acted earlier. Bad apples don't come good.
Thanks for this, Jimmy T – will be following your guidelines. What is it with NSW?
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