Flat Chat Strata Forum Common Property Current Page

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  • #67076
    PJ
    Flatchatter
      • I would really appreciate advice about what to do about an owner who after having his motion at an AGM to have exclusive use and access to a walkway on common property (CP) rejected, then proceeded to block off the access path to other residents without approval.
      • This owner then covered over pavers on this CP access with pebbles and soil to make it appear as if it is a garden, not a pathway.
      • The owner then painted over Common Property ceramic patio tiles without Strata committee knowledge or consent, which subsequently peeled within days.
      • This owner also has painted the CP first floor balcony floors and drilled into CP walls to put up decorative pots and ornaments.
      • He has only days ago listed the Unit for Sale.

      What actions can the Strata committee take to rectify this situation and make this owner and future owners responsible for the damage and unauthorised alterations made to common property which belongs to all owners. As the secretary of the strata committee I would appreciate your advice as long as it is legal.

    Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 16 total)
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    • #67089
      kaindub
      Flatchatter

        All these actions are covered by by laws. The by laws stay with the lot, not the owner.

        I would quickly take action through fair trading ( for mediation ) or NCAT for orders.

        I would then call the selling agent and advise that action has been started. The agent would need to disclose the action to prospective buyers, though a diligent strata search would also reveal this.

        #67157
        Flame Tree (Qld)
        Flatchatter

          I’d be putting a decent sign in sight from the Lot and on common property saying the exact unauthorized works are not included and are to be soon repatriated, with a suggestion all prospective owners be sure to have their conveyancing solicitor identify the formal Lot boundary and not take it as just what they are shown. It might also help to act as a prospective buyer and ask the agent to confirm such in writing, then it will likely be his head on the line as well as the seller. And acting as a interested neighbour visit the open house to be sure to ponder this aloud with other prospective buyers who would be interested in any intel they themselves would want to know before making any offer.

          #67173
          PJ
          Flatchatter
          Chat-starter

            Once an owner makes fairly un-rectifiable unauthorised changes to common property such at laying ceramic tiles over Common Property, who has ongoing responsibility for the maintenance of that altered space.

            Our Strata Manager states that these changes are then recorded under the Lot and the owner of that lot is then responsible for all ongoing maintenance.  Is this correct?

            Do the owners Corporation then have no monetary responsibility for ongoing maintenance only authority to approve/ not approve any future changes on behalf of all Body Corp. owners.

            Is there any references to this in the Fair Trading/NCAT legislation?

            • This reply was modified 1 year, 10 months ago by .
            #67178
            Jimmy-T
            Keymaster

              I think it’s been fairly well established that unapproved changes to the common property are subject to potential removal or remediation unless the owner has reached an agreement with the Owners Corp via a by-law.

              The reason for this is, partly, that there has to be ongoing responsibility for the changes which can be passed on to the next owner without a legal battle over who is responsible for what.

              In a case where an owner has made changes to the common property that the owners corp has not approved, the OC can ask the owners to either agree to a by-law (which they should pay for)  or pay for the reinstatement of the common property. Or the OC can seek orders requiring them to pay for the reinstatement and the costs of the action.  In other words, the OC is far from powerless in all this.

              The law on this is enshrined in Section 108 of the Act. I believe that having been given the choice between legitimising their work on common property or having it removed, no Tribunal is likely to side with the lot owner.

              The lot owner is protected in this in that the agreement can’t be rescinded later without their approval.

              Your strata manager is making up strata law as they go, probably thinking (hoping) that it’s no big deal and it’s less hassle for everyone if they just record it but do nothing with regard to Section 108.

              The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
              • This reply was modified 1 year, 10 months ago by .
              #67187
              tina
              Flatchatter

                I had this experience several years ago.  Here is what happened.  A lot owner breached Section 108 of the Strata Schemes Management Act 2015 (NSW) by attaching something to the exterior brick wall.  Our strata manager had two meetings with the owner, requesting the illegal structures be removed.  Lot owner declined.  Strata manager then applied for mediation with Office of Fair Trading NSW.  The Office sent multiple invitation letters to the owner.  The lot owner declined / did not respond to the invitations.  Then the strata manager applied to NCAT on behalf of the owners corporation.  NCAT ordered that the structures be removed and the owner pay for the cost of repairing the damage.  i.e. fill in the holes in the bricks.  The whole process took about nine months.

                We had to have evidence of attempted mediation before making the NCAT application.  Mediation through Office of Fair Trading is slow (months).  Maybe there are other ways to show that you attempted mediation?

                #67190
                Flame Tree (Qld)
                Flatchatter

                  When one owner does something silly, in a temporary or more permanent by-law or legislation breaching fashion, uninformed owners can think it is a committee fight only but that is not completely true. Sometimes the committee haven’t the fight in them, or go along with what to them is not an issue. Owners can still take up the matter personally with the right authority and if you think it will have long lasting, detrimental consequences that you won’t learn to live with, it might just be worth going it alone. Certainly, that’s the case in Queensland.

                  #67195
                  Jimmy-T
                  Keymaster

                    Maybe there are other ways to show that you attempted mediation?

                    Community Justice Centres in NSW provide a free mediation service for neighbourhood disputes but the Fair Trading and NCAT literature only refers to Fair Trading’s mediation service.

                    To be clear, evidence that you have attempted mediation is a compulsory prerequisite in most instances of going to the tribunal. The Tribunal’s factsheet only refers to the Fair Trading service but it doesn’t specify it to the exclusion of the CJC.  I suppose if the Fair Trading service was so busy that you would have to wait weeks or months, and you needed immediate action, you could try CJC.

                    The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                    #67207
                    Sir Humphrey
                    Strataguru

                      When we had an analogous situation, our EC let the selling real estate agent know that the owners had been issued with a ‘rules infringement notice’ re the unauthorised enclosure of common property (‘notice to comply’, I think, in NSW-speak). We had not yet reached the point of taking that on to the Tribunal before the unit was put on the market. The selling real estate agent was very diligent to let the more serious prospective purchasers know that the relevant unapproved fence had to come down and to make it clear where the boundaries were and the sorts of boundary treatments that were approvable under our rules. The new owners promptly fixed things up on moving in.

                      #67290
                      Eastover
                      Flatchatter

                        The requirement is for mediation by the Secretary under Division 2 or otherwise.

                        Mediation is required by section 227:

                        227 Certain applications cannot be accepted without prior mediation

                        (1) A registrar must not accept an application made to the Tribunal under this Act unless–

                        (a) mediation by the Secretary under Division 2 or otherwise has been attempted but was not successful, or

                        (b) a party refused to participate in the mediation, or

                        (c) the registrar considers that mediation is unnecessary or inappropriate in the circumstances.

                         

                        #67298
                        Jimmy-T
                        Keymaster

                          The requirement is for mediation by the Secretary under Division 2 or otherwise.

                          So the CJC mediation service or another recognised service would suffice, I suppose. Thanks for that.  FYI, readers, Richard is an eminent strata and property lawyer.

                          The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                          • This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by .
                          #67368
                          PJ
                          Flatchatter
                          Chat-starter

                            The Plot Thickens

                            The owner of the Unit where unauthorised changes were made to common property has now “lawyered up” and letters have now been sent to the Strata Secretary. The lawyer is threatening legal action by the owner against the committee and any individual members whom they state are acting outside their role and their scope of power, and hindering the sale of the lot owners unit. They have made no attempt to make repairs requested by committee…or address the underling issue that the owner made unauthorised changes to common property. The lawyers letter has made the accusation that the nature of the committee requests are “trivial” and that the recent conduct of the committee has become a nuisance in reference to the SC secretary’s contact with the selling agent to inform them of the common property issues. The secretary is currently collecting the evidence to Submit a request for Mediation by Fair Trading as was advised on this forum. Should our Strata committee be seeking our own legal representation or is this likely just bluff.

                            #67374
                            Jimmy-T
                            Keymaster

                              Should our Strata committee be seeking our own legal representation or is this likely just bluff.

                              Second question first – this is probably just typical non-strata-savvy lawyer bluff and bluster. The simple fact is that the owner has to declare anything to a purchaser that might affect their use of the property.  If they lie on the declaration, that is a criminal (I think) offence.

                              Just tell the lawyer that, especially in view of their letter, the committee will now be sure to diligently observe all requirements of strata and property law and you trust their client will do the same.  They should bear in mind that the owners corporation has a legal duty to protect common property for ALL owners.

                              As for hiring a strata lawyer, your call but a strongly worded letter might be all you need to get them back in their box.

                              By the way, I think lawyers who bend the facts to bully people into doing what their clients want should be struck off as a matter of course.

                              The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                              #67454
                              PJ
                              Flatchatter
                              Chat-starter

                                Can a Lawyer legally demand Strata Committee Agendas and Minutes from meetings.

                                The Update from above is that the Owner’s Lawyer has demanded he be sent copies of the Agenda and Minutes from the last Strata Committee meeting. He states he needs to check that the strata committee has acted within its scope and with full support from the Body Corporate. He is claiming the committee has been vexatiously pursuing his clients to prevent them selling their unit. He has made 2 demands for this now and I have been of the opinion that our Strata Committee agendas and minutes are the private business of the Body Corporate and are not the business of anyone outside these owners and the Strata Manager. Heaven forbid sharing with a local lawyer with who knows what dubious dealings. There is a lot of information about our strata in the minutes which does not need to be shared. For the record I distributed the Minutes of the last Strata Committee meeting to all owners via the Strata Manager within 2 days of the meeting. In the minutes the first agenda item was dealing with this owner’s breach of By Laws and a Plan of Action. For the record I have  had no contact from any owners with concerns about this Plan, apart from the Owner’s who have made the unauthorised alterations to common property. Should this meeting have been a meeting with all owners and not just Strata Committee. By the way this whole nasty business has resulted in 2 members of the committee resigning within the last week.

                                #67456
                                Jimmy-T
                                Keymaster

                                  He states he needs to check that the strata committee has acted within its scope and with full support from the Body Corporate.

                                  This lawyer needs to read up on his strata law.  The committee is empowered by the Act by default to act on behalf of the owners corporation except for in the very few matters where the law states that decisions can only be made by the owners corporation at a general meeting.

                                  Issuing notices to comply and requiring owners to not annex common property are not decisions that require a meeting of the full owners corporation.

                                  This is the kind of a-hole who gives lawyers a bad name. How about you tell him a) to point out where in law it says his client can annex common property without permission and b) that if he doesn’t pull his head in you will report him to the Law Society for knowingly giving unsound advice to his client for the purpose of bullying members of a strata committee into making a decision that violates strata law.

                                  Or you could just tell him to stop harassing the strata committee and take it to NCAT and see how he gets on there.

                                  But really, all you need to do is commence a mediation at Fair Trading with a view to seeking orders  at NCAT and if the owner doesn’t reveal that to potential purchasers he is breaking the law.

                                  The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                                  • This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by .
                                  #67458
                                  Just Asking
                                  Flatchatter

                                    A bit odd this lawyer is demanding documents which his clients as lot owners would already have? Surely it is the lot owners and their lawyer who are potentially sabotaging a sale as the minutes and correspondence would reveal the situation upon a strata search by an interested purchaser?

                                    Also, the lot owners cannot sell what they do not own or have rights over, and this defect in title could undo any transaction.

                                    The issue is not one which could be resolved for the lot owners by any amount of threats or bullying toward the strata committee.

                                    The nature of the lawyer’s correspondence appears somewhat unprofessional, perhaps even defamatory, and you are able to lodge a complaint about this type of behaviour.

                                     

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